Finished the model today, and I'm almost done with the boards. Here's what I came up with, a flip phone that converts from a 'bar phone' into a potent digital camera, huge battery, SD card storage, mp3 abilities, 5mp camera, and most importantly it's more of a camera with the added features of a phone, instead of the other way around. Also, the twin LCDs share a common backlight to save energy and space. Few other things I'm sure I'm forgetting. Thank you all for your input!










I wound up with a very very feasible product (I purposely built it a LITTLE big just for the sake of detail) that does not require any future voodoo technology. Given the large volume of the battery pack, it should have fantastic battery life, and I left plenty of room for the camera lense and mechanism, so that's doable also. I dislike the Motorola ROKR microSD storage solution, regular SD cards are pretty dang small anyway, and they're getting pretty great storage capacities now. There'd probably even be room for two cards, but that'd be weird. I dislike camera phones because they're primarily cell phones with a camera tacked onto them. They're getting better, but the lack of real camera capabilities makes htem a joke to me, I don't see the point in them. They take ass pictures that you can't print, and the res is so bad it looks horrid on your computer. So, I first and formost set out to think the other way.... start with a camera, and how could i make it into a phone. Flipping it around worked great. If it were to go into production one side would have small magnets inside it that would make it pleasently 'stick' to the otherside, so it woldn't be all floppy/willy nilly.

Successful? Sure. I'd get one today, especially since my canon is dying. A decent camera with decent controls and manual capabilities, a cell phone, and an MP3 player with a cheap, plentiful storage solution.

I think it's a bit too fat, if you look at the very thin Samsung phones and those tiny cameras like the Sony T series I think you can reduce the size while keeping a decent camera with optical zoom. Especially the phone part looks too big to me.

How does the screen work? Do you have 2 screens or how is that supposed to work?

Not too happy with the shutter release position, dunno, I think the placement should be more at the corner.

Btw. Samsung has been mixing cameras with phones for a while now, taking their normal cameras with zoom, normal sized sensors (think Canon G series), the possibility to add lens converters etc. and fitting mobile phones to them. Pretty expensive though.

I like the idea process but personally I think a single monoblock can be the quickest and easiest camera + phone solution. It is the closest to modern day cameras and if you look at sony's cybershot range you can see that.

Would be good if you can post some images showing the user going through the exact process of switching from phone to camera with it in their hands

From a logistics standpoint I wonder if all of that will fit into that size of a package.

I get your gripes about camera phones, but you should probably realize the reason for that is really based around market demand, not technology availabilty. Most people who have camera phones use the camera to take pictures for displaying as their backgrounds or sending to friends on their phones, not for printing or real photography purposes. The other problem is you left out a flash in your design. I would never consider replacing a point and shoot camera with something that didn't have a flash. The thinness of the camera section also means you aren't going to be able to get any kind of zoom lense in that small of a package, so in the end, it's still a phone with a camera tacked on, even if it was concieved the other way around.

Heres pictures taken with one of Ericssons new camera phones and its on par with anything you'd get from a mid range point and shoot camera. http://www.mobile-review.com/review/sonyer...ilma-3-en.shtml

I also think you'd have a lot of problems creating that connection between the 2 halves. Not only is there the physical connection, but the digital one. Most flip phones are able to use a fairly rigid ribbon cable because the phone is usally only flipping ~150°. Because theres 2 connections, it means theres going to have to be 2 seperate areas where it can flex on that cable, and both would need to be able to twist a full 180° and still fit through a very, very tiny hole. If you've ever used an old laptop that had screen that would flicker/shimmer it's always because those tiny cables undergo so much friction that they were prone to failure.

Visually the design is pretty plain and doesn't seem to match up to any of your concept drawings? Are the drawings of the final product not shown or did it just change when being turned into a model?

It's about the size of a canon SD10, a little thicker. I figured it was okay to be a little extra big, just to make sure it was completley viable.



Basically, two LCDs, with a shared backlight. The backlight is inbetween them. And yes, two screens.



I copied the shutter release position from my Canon, it's in a great place once you put your hands on it. I have that in my last board, which I'm almost done with.

It definitely will. I left plenty of room for everything. The side with the camera lense/battery is pretty thick, and could probably be made even thinner.



It's on the hinge section, opposite side of the ear piece. When it's in camera mode, look to the right of the lense. That's the flash.



The thickness of the side with the lense is about the same as my Canon SD10. While my camera lacks optical zoom, newer revisions are the same size and manage a 2.8x optical zoom. And honestly, I don't feel that optical zoom is all that important anymore. Decent MP= just crop your photo later. Considering this camera will have about the same specs as a canon SD20 or SD30, it's definitely not a phone with a camera tacked on. It even has camera specific controls, in camera mode, allowing a functional and useful menu system catering JUST to a camera.

Yes, but the thing just seems to be a camera + a mobile phone tacked on. Having it all in one thing makes more sense to me, sharing all possible components (the buttons being a problem... but I think I have an idea that could work. Make the keypad in a way that you can flip them away -> gives access to full camera functions).

Cropping the photo may work if absolutely neccessary, but I'd never give up an actual zoom lens. High MP -> lots of noise, especially if you take just a part of the image. Unless the sensor is huge, which would mean the lens has to be huge aswell, in which place you could also have used a zoom lens.

Btw. I also prefer your concepts, especially the flip display one is cool IMHO and would work nicely I think.

OT: The Sony has pretty much CA, is a bit noisy (which makes me wonder because judging by the lens the sensor should be of a decent size, and with such a low resolution noise should be rather low), the image seems washed out, especially if there isn't too much light available. Also I recall that the flash should be as far as possible from the lens, in order to avoid red eyes. I'd say the image quality of my old Canon with 2 MP is better, though recent camera phones aren't too bad anymore.

interesting concept,

this is what i liked at the CeBiT expo last month in Germany:



new double sides samsung phone

Yeah, I saw that samsung halfway through making my model. It's okay, but I bet the camera sucks and the battery life stinks. It probably doesn't use an SD card either. It's a start though, as I HATE multifunction buttons that do everything yet nothing well.

Yeah, the camera will suck, but thats not what it was created for anyway, so that doesn't matter.

But writing SMS would suck, because you would be forced to use the tiny screen for that.

It's too big I think - and you've targetted a problem market. You've aimed at it being a camera first, but a professional is going to buy a stand alone camera, and the consumer isn't going to want to carry that and a phone, so that has to be the phone too. When I look for a new phone, the quality of the camera is very high on the list, but it's always second to how good the phone is, and how it looks - the aesthetics don't seem to have recieved much attention here.

And you said it would be an mp3 player, but there doesn't seem to be any mp3 controls there - my current phone has an mp3, but it uses the regular phone controls which are just terrible, so it is never used.

It was never intended to replace a 'professional's camera', that's why it isn't a DSLR. It's intended to cater toward a market like I exist in: Someone who uses a digital camera a lot, goes to parties, goes backpacking, and generally has a pretty active lifestyle but likes to lug along a camera. I love my canon SD10. I just hate how full my pockets are when I have that, and my cell phone. Together they're much too big.

Hi cash68,

first of all I think that it's really good that you tried to present the whole design process, although I think that you could have spend a bit more time on user/problem research. What do the users care about, what are problems handling a camera/mobile in daily life and what kind of visual language could underline the concept? The general problem with this kind of "multifunction-devices" is that there are two or more functions that don't necessarily have something in common. Listening to music don't has much to do with making phone calls or taking pictures. And if this connections are forced (as in many existing products) it often ends up in a confusing device. Still some kind of unsolved design riddle... :-)

Anyway, I really love the hinge and the clapping mechanism and I'm a fan of using it myself (flapcam.matthiaslange.de) :-)

keep up the good work,
Matthias

whats the benefit of attatching a phone to a camera? i read the part about saving pocket room, but didn't your phamera grow in size compared to the average? if it isn't meant to take pro quality pics, whats wrong with with the camera phone out there allready?

i think you also said it has an integrated MP3 player as well. what really is the difference between this and every other one on the market? outside of its larger, which kind of contradicts your initial reasoning.

Personally, i don't really see the benefit of attatching a camera to a phone, let alone a phone to a camera.

no offense, but it seems like every other product out there.

newt

So, does the device have 2 different screens? I think it is an interesting concept but it isn't suitable for cheap manufacturing. I also think that the device looks too bulky and fat, but that is just my opinion. Even the Samsung phone with 10 megapixles is around the size of a regular candy-bar phone. And although it is my own design philosophy, I feel that simple is better. Design is about doing things in new ways but, we also have to make things better and easier to do than traditional methods. Finally, isn't the UI from a Sandisk mp3 player?


I hope this hel